Hello Friends,
I was wondering if there are any recommended Salsa instructors for on2 dancers in the San Jose area?
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Hello Friends,
Some of my friends constant download salsa music torrents. I guess even though that is not looked down upon like downloading music of a major music label but I still wondered what the salsa community thought about it. I always preferred to pay to buy my music but a lot of old songs especially are not available to buy. -
Hey Friends,
One of the instructors I know is actually teaching dancing cha cha on 1. The instructor is very graceful and has good body movement but I always thought that dancing cha-cha on 1 was not possible. If you dance on 1 then on beat 3 both your foot are together and on 4 and 4.5 you shuffle your feet and on 5 you take a step back making the dance feel uneven. In between 3&4 a whole beat you shuffle your foot and then between 4.5 & 5 you take a full step back which feels awkward. Dancing cha-cha on 2 feels a lot more even since you shuffle your foot on the half beats. Was wondering if anyone does really dance cha-cha on 1. -
Hello friends,
I have a carpeted apartment. I would like a setup a small spot for practicing salsa. One of my friends who faced the same problem bought a carton of hardwood flooring and set it up on the carpet, however it would fall apart while practicing. So he purchased metal crown molding and nailed them into the carpet to hold the hardwood flooring in place. Has anyone else tried this? Any better alternatives?jlon2
I bought a 6×4 piece of laminate and taped it on the floor. Scratch that it wasn’t carpet. Plywood should work as it’s heavy enough to not move around. You can just use the plywood itself or place the flooring on top of it.
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Hello Friends,
I recently started swing dancing. I was surprised to see that I could figure out Swing music in just 2 days. While dancing Swing I don’t count but just feel the downbeat in the music. Compared to this I still have to specifically listen to the 2nd and 4th beats(being an on2 dancer) while dancing Salsa. In spite of listening to Salsa music for almost 2 years, I still don’t feel Salsa music as much as I do Swing. If I could feel Salsa like the way I feel Swing, it would make my dancing so much better. I am wondering if this is because I started Salsa first before going to Swing, or Swing is much easier music than Salsa(just like Bachata) or it is just that psychologically, I am still trying to hard in Salsa to count or hear the beats rather than just feeling it? -
Hey Anthony,
I love your iphone app ‘Pocket Salsa’. I was wondering if you could present the patterns on 2 count also. Also on the addicted2salsa website there are a number of patterns that are not present on the iphone app. Are there any plans to port them to the iphone app. I had a question about the copa loop over that is present in the Advanced section of your Pocket Salsa app for the iphone. After the copa, you start leading the turn on 5. At this point the weight of the lady is on her left foot making it difficult for her to do the turn. I dance on 2 and when I try to do this pattern it seems easier for me to do it immediately after the copa on the beat 1(on2 count). So I was wondering if on 1 also you should be starting the lead on the 3rd beat immediately after the copa.
Anthony Persaud
1) We plan to do something with presenting On2 patterns. We just want to do it right (takes a lot of thought on how to organize material). We want to make sure there is an order in the videos to help people get up to speed quickly and minimize confusion on whether they should do on1/on2 and what the timing differences are.
2) We will be making update to the full version of the iPhone app to support viewing the Podcast from the phone. Currently the iPhone/ iPod Touch app contains videos not found on the website as we consider it supplemental reference material to our podcast. I’m still working on implementing this, but I’m first working on getting the main application ported over to iOS 4 (in addition to having Apple resolve some uploading issues on their end).
3) You could lead the copa that way, but I would emphasize that stopping her would be more appropriately done on count 3, and the indication to start turning should happen on count 5 since between 3 and 5, the lady is transitioning her weight during this time. This transition allows you to help her know that she will be doing a turn after count 5.
OUsalsero
This app looks great. It would have been enough to make me get an iPhone if I hadn’t just purchased an Android. When is the Android version coming out?
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Hello Friends,
I am an on 2 dancer and have been learning the instruments in salsa music lately. I can figure out the clave, the tumbao, the timbales etc. The instrument that I hear the most is the campana(cow bell) or what I think it is. The only problem which I have been facing for about 2 months is I can’t hear the 3rd beat of the campana. All websites and sample music of campana that I listen to mentions that there is a strike on 3. I also understand that that the simple bongo bell plays on 1-3-5-7. However, this is what I hear:teh – teh —- teh teh the- teh teh the- tet tet
(1) – (2) (3 or 4) (6) & 7 (8) &I can’t hear the 3 or feel the ‘teh teh the’ after the 2nd beat starts on 3 instead of 4. I sometimes also wonder if I am confusing the mambo bell for campana or if both are playing simulataneously and I am hearing the mambo bell (3 &). However, in almost 95% of the songs I hear the campana and rarely do I hear the mambo bell or timbales.
cold.salsero
I think that before we can continue this discussion, we need to make sure we’re on the same page in terms of instruments and the kinds of patterns and sounds they make. This is what I understand some of the percussion instruments in salsa to be (correct me if I’m wrong anywhere):
- Clave: I think this is pretty simple
- Conga drums: this is what plays the tumbao pattern…I think
- Timbales. I’ve heard and read that a common pattern on the timables is the cascara, and I think it sounds like what you’re describing above, but I’m not 100% sure.
- Cow bell: I’ve heard this played with many different patterns, the most common being just on the odd beats 1 3 5 7. I’ve also heard it emphasize 2 sometimes, and also strike 2 & 3, 4 & 5, 6 & 7, 8 &1 sort of cha cha style sometimes.
- Bongo bell: I’ve never heard of this one before, though I’ve heard of bongo drums…?
- Mambo bell: I’ve also never heard of this one beforeDo you have any examples of the websites where you’ve heard any of these played or described?
salilsurendran
cold.salsero. you are very correct in your description of all the instruments. On the cow bell it strikes 2,3,4&5, 6&7, 8&1. On this I can’t hear the 3. bongo bell and cowbell, campana are all the same instruments. mambo bell also plays the cascara.
cold.salsero
I’m not sure if this will help you, but I think you might like it anyway: http://www.salsabeatmachine.org/. It’s a free program. You can set it up to play different patterns on the timbales and cow bell, and if you click on the instruments tab, you can configure it to play all kinds of different bass and piano patterns too.
salilsurendran
i use the salsabeatmachine everyday. I can’t make out the 3 of the campana in normal music. I will be putting up some examples on youtube.
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Hello Friends,
I have been dancing on2 for about 1.5 years. My initial troubles with getting the beat is over. I can clearly make out the 2 beat and lead the girl through double spins and patterns like that. However, I want to make my dance attractive. I have seen some guys even when they do simple patterns they look like a solid dancer and some guys will do a very complex pattern and look rough and unpolished though they end up in time. Also I have noticed that girls look much more polished than guys. I guess this is because girls do a lot of spinning and basic steps that help their balance. I was wondering as to what would help me look smooth and balanced while dancing. Some instructors have told me that doing shines and spins will help because it will make your footwork faster and improve balance. Also I am trying out some yoga. In NYC there are some body conditioning classes but not in the place where I live.cold.salsero
Shines will definitely help you become a better dancer (they’ll help with your styling too, whether you’re a guy or a girl), and they’ll help you a lot with your musicality, which is very important.
I’ve also heard from more than one person that performing helps you become a better social dancer, though I haven’t performed anything myself…yet.
I wish I could spin like girls too, I think that learning how to spin well will definitely improve any leader’s social dancing and help balance out the leader’s partnerwork, like girl spins, then guy spins, then girl spins again, etc.
dcs5743
First I have to say that everyone has their own individual style on what’s “good,” but there are generalities too which cold.salsero touched on. Speaking from experience performing and shines in general help, I’ve been on a dance team for a year and do shines as well.
Breaking the dance down, it comes to
-Spinning
-Body Isolations, movement & Styling
-Leading and following techniques
-Knowledge of Figures that are built into combinationsTypically women/followers develop the first two stronger, while men/leaders develop the latter two If you work on your weaknesses and become equally strong in all four you will be a great dancer.
I’d agree that yoga would help but that’s only part of it, getting in something that lets you be aware of movement as well would help too. Which shines again can work, but you can try workshops that focus on body movement (like the youtube video at the end). Or something like Tai Chi Chuan since movement is movement. So once you are aware of how to move one way like the Tai Chi example, you’d be able to pick up some Afro-Cuban movement more quickly, like this one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FviZ9Ct_r18
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vGx2boeKA28&feature=relatedNo matter the how you choose to go or who you choose to listen to, the choice is yours in how you want to improve.
iSalsa
I think cross training with other “activities” is essential to developing a certain “style.” Alex da Silva used to do Capoeira. I myself did 1.5 yrs of Capoeira, 2 yrs of Karate, 6 months of Taekwondo, 2 years of Krav Maga, 2 yrs of Tennis and I’ve been roller blading for ever. Over time it all adds up. But the most beneficial I think in order of importance are:
Tons of footwork
Performance group
Martial arts classes(Capoeira will help out with balance and perceiving the floor as being “soft and friendly” )
Perhaps roller blading as wellsalilsurendran
Wow doing martial arts and roller blading are way extreme, I guess but anything that helps your balance should help your dancing. I was thinking more about yoga and stuff like that to help balance and flexibility.
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Can someone tell me the name of this song and maybe the artist name. If you can’t name the song can someone spell out some lyrics in English so that I can try and download it from iTunes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlUKv2Mnt_w&feature=related . The song starts at 1:42 into the video.
Michael
don’t know exactly, but the female singer should be Judy Santos. you could try start searching for the song by listening to songs from Grupo NV feat. Judy Santos. hope this will help..
salilsurendran
I tried this song ‘Por Un Rato’ on this link
http://www.legalsounds.com/download-mp3/grupo-nv-y-judy-santos/latin-4.0-bachata-%28cd-10%29/por-un-rato/song_2081699. But that is not the one.
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Hello Friends,
I was planning a vacation in either Hawaii or Puerto Rico. I was wondering which place would be better for Salsa dancing. I guess probably Puerto Rico but I always wanted to visit Hawaii. Though my aim is not go there for Salsa dancing but just to have fun but I thought that it would be great if I could go out at night for Salsa dancing. -
has anyone heard of this software salsa grooves http://www.jazzydanceco.com/salsa/content/blogcategory/29/93/lang,en/. One famous instructor had a musicality workshop and recommended this software to me. I was wondering if it is worth spending $35 to buy it
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I need to get better with Salsa music. I can find the beat but with counting. I would like to stop counting and just hear the clave or congo and step to it. I have listen to a lot of clave and congo only tracks and practised dancing to it. However, in a real song I can’t hear the clave or the congo. I would like to know how to fit the clave or congo pattern into a salsa song.
lonbluster
Well thought!! Counting is just slowing you down!
Anyway I guess you need to become somewhat of a musician if you want to achieve this. When I practise I use a couple of chinese sticks(or clave sticks if nobody’s at home) which I struck on the clave and conga beats, on the counts, on half counts, etcc..The clave is not played most of the time, that’s why you can’t hear it, but nonetheless it is the key around which all the instruments are playing, in the same way they are respecting the measures (the 1234 counts).
Even as an expert you can initially interpret the clave pattern differently from what it actually is, but if you train well you can identify it with ease.
The conga is a very bass sound, lower than a bass itself, and most of the times you can barely distinguish it, eventhough it is influencing your dancing.
I think both the clave and the conga has to be played mentally if you don’t hear them, and that would make sense, because they are actually there!!
lonbluster
The Clave struck is on the counts
2-3-5-6½-8 (clave 2/3)
or
1-2½-4-6-7 (clave 3/2)
therefore encompassing 2 measures (twice the count 1234).The main Conga pattern struck is repetitive at the same way a measure is, but it “kind of joins” 2 of them:
4-4½-2
which can be said as:
8-8½-2
or
4-4½-6
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One of my instructors told me that doing shines is the best way to improve ones dancing. Come to think of it may not be the best way to improve dancing but sure would be fun. In his classes he teaches a shine routine which is pretty fast and says that if we practise this then it will improve our dancing a lot. Would there me any dvds of shines like those to a whole song that one could aim at mastering? Another thing he said was to spot while turning. I haven’t seen a lot of men spot while turning? Would this be a good strategy. It does hurt my neck a bit to spot.
jovi
Shines for man?
nice body movement comes from strength, flexibility and esthetics(a kind of flow). This maybe can help you:
http://www.salsavideo.ru/actions/tim2007.htmAnother factor to improve dancing is to synchronize your movements with music. I mean if the foot touches the floor exact at the same time you hear a BAM in the music then your step looks powerfull(even it was a light footstep). If you move your hip to cascara/maracas it looks better than shaking some meat. Music is like lipstic, it makes people beatiful (if they have the right timeing).
Use your brain is the most powerful thing. Anthonys videos are great, because he explains things. It is more important to understand what a rubberband effect is than just perform the move. There are many more hints. Use those to improve your own dancing-personality. (Only to succed the pattern is too simple, isn’t it?)
Speed is also a challenging thing expecially when someone stars salsa dancing. Technique which was usefull to me was to download a player where you can change the speed of the music(most karaoke-players do that). If your timeing is right at the top speed …
(don’t forget the body – music synchronization)Male dancers looks good on the danceflor not because they are nice looking(they will never be on the long run = after 2 till 3 songs). Male dancers becomes only then attractive when they succed to make the girl look like most sweetest, eyecatchy candy on the dancefloor. Or to make the girl look like the most excited person in the room. Therefore you have to pay attention at those three things: painfree, stressfree, alternation.
painfree: means not to crash into other couples, unsuccessfull dips and to hold girl’s hand with the thumb while she is spinning.
stressfree: is to signal the leadsigns in time. e.g. if you want the girl to turn, start to lift the hand 1count bevore the turn. You must not ignore girls shape and size, lead only patterns which are suited to the girl(your shape, size, speed and sthength are also important).
alternation: is nice combinations. Some leaders are eable to make a nice dance by only using a vew patterns, some brings new patterns. Make the girl busy in a exciting way(=not too busy). If the girl want to be creative(=doing shines) let her do so.If a girl don’t smile or seems not to be excited, … , it’s disappointing, but you have to do your best at least to the end of the song.(your reward will be “yes” for the next song by another girl)
To spot or not to spot, hope you can see the difference here:
http://www.nuevotec.com/index.php?title=Social+dance+-+Joe+Burgos+and+Rebecca&option=com_zoom&Itemid=38&page=view&catid=160&PageNo=1&key=11&hit=1
and I want to forward you a advice my medic told me “If something hurts, then your body is trying to tell you to stop doing that.” so don’t twirl your neck too wild.———————————
Salsa learning is fun … when i read my post it sounds like hard work.
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Hello friends,
I had a question and please don’t laugh at it. I was wondering if there are any patterns in which guys spin like the way girls do? I was thinking it would be cool if guys spin like 2-3 times like the way girls do but in my area i don’t see guys spinning at all. I see a lot of girls spinning. By spinning I don’t mean the usual right or left turn but like spinning fast 2-3 times in say 4 beats. I am thinking there must be patterns like that but most guys in my area just don’t do that?
Marco
Salil,
I think that if you youtube search for Paul Baarn, he has a male turns tutorial.
Daniel Ellis
There are two ways in which I do multiple spins in partnerwork that are relatively simple.
1) I often just do a double or triple left spin while my partner styles in place. I ‘drop’ my partners right arm at my ribcage or waist while I spin so that we stay connected.
2) Another option is to do a shoulder turn off a cross body lead, and stop your partner one half turn before she is completed to do a ‘check’ or reverse of direction. Once you stop her, you can both prep simultaneously on 1,2,3 (assuming on1), and spin individually on 5,6,7.
I hope these make sense…if not, let me know and maybe I can put them on video for you.
Best,
D
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I am kind of a situation which I don’t know whether it is unique or not and find it difficult to describe in words. When I started out as a beginner I would probably dance 75% of the time I was in a club. Now I am getting a little bit intermediate and I find that a lot of advanced girls dance with me with no emotion or dance about half the song and say thanks. I find this pretty disheartening. The girls who want to dance with me are below my level and I can’t practise any of the new moves that I learn which are intermediate level. So I am kind of in a catch 22 situation where if I have to get better I have to dance with advanced girls but since I can’t do most of the moves I learn with beginner girls I don’t advance. I have seen that some dancers keep dancing with the same girl who is at their level without asking anyone advanced or below their level. I kind of prefer to dance with a girl only once in a evening. Should I keep dancing with the couple of girls that are happy dancing with me and ask a advanced girl say once every month? Should I just avoid dancing with a advanced girl who is not interested in dancing with me or is it ok if she dances for just half the song? What is the social norm here if a girl doesn’t seem excited with your dancing is she just telling you to not ask her anymore? I don’t know if girls face the same kind of problem but one of the beginner girls i dance with regularly complain that guys don’t wanna dance with her because she is a beginner. This sort of does reduce our enthusiasm to dance.
Also I find myself spending more time than usual not dancing either because it’s bachata where i don’t know a lot of moves or merengue which I find boring. I kind of feel uncomfortable during this period of time and feel like people are watching me and thinking that I am not getting to dance because I am not a good dancer. I think this is not true because I notice a lot of good dancers sit out a long time. During this period they are usually chatting or drinking something. So what does one do to fill time and get bored in between dances?
tommrod
‘s up salilsurendran
really i relate to what you say.
lucky me (and i don’t know if that’ll help) come the time… i don’t really care if the lady is just a beginner.
what i do care about is to make her feel comfortable, if she gets too nervous she will probably mess up, as much as i do when i do get nervous, try to lead her into more complicated patterns, but just as much as i can read into her to see what can she do, i struggle to make us look good, and to improve my smoothness of course. i practice all that and i try to have fun, but it will be off putting if she doesn’t have fun and/or gets uncomfortable and/or bored.am i still practicing? yes! balance, timing, what i call “tension”, communication as a whole, and i try to have fun even though probably i won’t be able to practice many patterns or so.
is it more fun to dance with a more seasoned female dancer? of course, and not, it depends like you notice on the person, what good is it if you can manage to do a lot of patterns if the lady is not “feeling” it, or being plain bored? doesn’t that bother you also?
i consider myself a beginner, and it is pretty pleasing when a lady tells me that i’m good (though i know they probbly haven’t dance much).
so also check out this trick i use, i usually ask a girl to dance when the music’s almost over, that way her and i have a taste of each other, in a ” dancing ” way, if i don’t like her i thank her and part ways, if i do like her i ask her to continue on the next song, which gives her the chance to reject me also but knowing what i can do.
and if i like somebody i’ve danced with, i ask her to reserve a later dance for me, and just walk away.
it seems to me that some dancers are more worried on performing than enjoying, and i won’t judge but it doesn’t feel to me like the spirit of dance comes from other people’s eyes but from what pleases us as a whole body mind entity…kind of like sex.
Nayan
Salil, I share the same exact feeling.
Over the past 2 years, I have danced mostly with beginners. Most of them were more fun, with manageable attitude.I guess, with growing expertise, the girls become more like i-have-seen-this-stuff-you-doing. Well, I won’t know really, but I feel this could be a reason.
Not everyone in the club is to make others feel good by smiling all the time and say “you’re a good dancer.” I accepted this and focus on self-improvement (like tommrod said) and also make sure the girl I am dancing with is having fun.
Enjoy the dancing when in the club. Keep the practicing to minimum there. Dance Schools and home are the places to practice.
Though I do not have the perfect solution (Last night in the club, I surely didn’t have fun :-/) and I face this problem now not so often (because I stopped worrying so much about it), there are ways to improve yourself and have fun.
Wil
I’ve been taking salsa classes for about 4.5 months now and I’m at a really weird point in my salsa learning process. To start I’m puerto rican so being latino we would walk onto the dance floor and expect to dance good…well after taking my first On2 class I was quickly humbled
. The situation with me now is I find myself constantly counting, and thinking…it’s a mess! Before I would go onto the dance floor and just dance…I could care less if it looked good I was just having fun enjoying the music. Now I’m worried about if I’m moving to fast, did I do the turn to slow. Or boy I hope no one caught the mess up. Has anyone else gone through this? How did you get over it?
Salil Surendran
Hey Wil, Yes when I started taking on2 lessons I had the same issues. But I used to dance on1 I think what you are doing before the on2 classes is just dancing to the music without caring about timing or leading. Well in your case I guess you will just have to practise timing your moves if you want to dance on time and lead correctly.
Marie-B
Hey!
Coming back to the first intervention, I was kind of in the same jiffy but it was mainly my fault. As I’ve gotten better, I’ve become pickier. Now I only dance on the songs that I like. At a certain point, I would only dance with the good dancers because I thought I wouldn’t have fun with the more beginner dancers. However, what I’ve quickly came to realise is if the girl is advanced enough she could follow any guy and make him look good. So I’ve started dancing with the more beginner dancers again to practice getting use to any lead.
Also When I go social dancing, I usually try and bring a couple of friends of the same level as me that way, I can enjoy dancing with everybody and my friends who I know better (and we usually know the same moves). It also makes the dance more personnal. I could more easily do styling with them because I know what to expect and so do they!tommrod
@Marie-B:
marie-b said:
However, what I’ve quickly came to realise is if the girl is advanced enough she could follow any guy and make him look good. So I’ve started dancing with the more beginner dancers again to practice getting use to any lead.
that’s the spirit!
jenny
I love what you guys are saying about this, from a follows perspective, maybe more advanced follows feel like a practice dummy for those guys who are trying out their advanced moves but don’t really know how to lead them yet. This can be uncomfortable emotionally and physically. Perhaps the follow feels that a man just wants to bust out a recent move he saw on youtube, and not actually connect with her as a dance partner… Connectivity, as many of you have said so far, is often way more rewarding than trying to pull off a move that you don’t really know in the name of becoming a more advanced dancer. just an idea…
Salil
@jenny: I don’t think I am trying some untried moves on those girls. I definitely do get off timing when I do a combo. However, I was speaking with a friend who has been dancing for 9 years and he told me that he thought that the transition from beginner to intermediate was more tougher than the beginning stage of the dance. He said that intermediate or advanced girls don’t give the kind of follow or reception because of their perception of you as dancer below their par and it is tough to break that image. They would put in their 50% whereas when they dance with someone advanced they would put in their 100%. I kind was feeling that way even though I am not saying that I am not making mistakes. I noticed that some girls won’t even make a right turn though I think my lead on that is pretty clear. I have also noticed that when I dance with a girl who perceives me to be better than her and I make a mistake she says sorry and I have to correct her and say it is my fault.
Jenny
@Salil: I appreciate the experience of going through a learning curve for sure. I also give props to any lead that wants to stray from his beginner move set and expand beyond into having many moves at his “fingertips” so to speak, and can bust them out with the ladies. I always admire any lead who is willing to put himslef out there. I can’t speak for all follows, but I generally try to make every dance a great dance no matter who I dance with(unless he is just creepy, which surly, is no one on the addicted2salsa blog!) I try to make my lead feel that I appreciate him and that our dance is fun and playful. I can say that the tact and method that he introduces the moves that he is workin on is really important. In my opinion, perhaps a lead could start slow, get the feel for his partner, try something – say a simple element of a complicated move, then build it up and finally bust out the full complicated move. Chances are you will both walk away satisfyed and happy with your dance. This may work really well on a more beginner follow as well and bring you both to a new level in your dancing abilities.
Salil
That is something that I think I should do too. Maybe I should break down a combo into smaller steps and then do the whole routinue. I tried this yesterday and it seemed to work well. I think I try to make a girl feel good about her dancing too. Anyway I am starting to have fun again. I don’t try to dance with every girl in the room, I just dance with the girls I like to dance with, practise as much as I can and then leave the club go home and practise the moves I messed up solo.
JNNT
Salil, as a beginning intermediate dancer I can relate to your comments. I try to dance with a variety of women from beginners to very good followers. It’s good to follow Marie’s advice on starting with very simple moves (CBL, outside turn) then progress to something slightly more complicated (CBL inside turn) and then progress to combo patterns. At times I get a more advanced follower who clearly gets a little bored and knows most all the moves that are coming, but most of the time even the advanced dancers appreciate someone who can lead simple patterns well. I feel it’s also important to adapt to your partner’s following style– some women will turn at the slightest hint of a lead and offer no resistance and others that dance with more tension need a stronger lead. Yeah, dancing only half the song is lame – unless the guy’s creepy or constantly bumping his partner into other people that shouldn’t be the norm (at least it isn’t the norm in SF!)
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Hello Friends,
I have trouble doing the titanic. Whenever, I do the cross body lead and spread her arms out for some reason each and every girl doesn’t realize it’s the titanic and seems to continue moving in the cross body lead direction. This leads to a very jerky kind of motion where I have to stop her midway(of course i am holding both her hands) and then go back on 1-2-3 then spin her. I am wondering what would be a good way to tell the girl that the titanic is coming. One of the girls told me that I was doing the titanic right but she had only practised it once. I wonder if it is necessary for the girl to know moves like the titanic and copas etc. to do it right or I can improve my lead to make the girl do even things she doesn’t know.
I would say i am a beginner to intermediate dancer. Like i can do the titanic and copas and 3 move combos. Do you think it is a good time to incorporate shines into my dancing? I am kind of worried that my partners might think that I am doing shines which is kind of advanced when I am not really advanced in salsa.
Another issue is that some of the clubs have beginner girls who have been dancing for say 3 years but have never taken classes they are there just to socialize. Many times they don’t even complete the basic right turn in time. Should I try to be more forceful with my lead and get her to complete the turn. I don’t want to tell the girl what to do since I am afraid i might offend her.donv69
I tried doing the Titanic with a girl that didn’t know the move and she got confused. But I tried it with an advanced girl who had never heard of it either and prior to doing the move asked her real quick; she was from Israel; and she didn’t know it. She told me to lead her through it and it went great.
So my guess is if they have never tried a similar move, it won’t go.
I never tell a girl what to do. Sometimes it’s hard to tell if it’s you or her. So I just go back to the beginning and do the simple stuff first and see how far I can get.
Marco
Yeah, dancing with new partners involves a progression of complication.
I will start off with your second to last sentence; Being more forcefull with the lead is usually not the solution. It can sometimes lead to a breakdown in communication (non-verbal communication of course). Try your best to look out for her comfort and safety and you will both be better off.
As to the progression, with new follows I personally precede a titanic with some simpler moves that are similar in nature. Basic> Outside turn> Inside turn> CrossBLead> CBL with Inside turn> CBL with Outside turn.
If the follow can do these without much complication then I run a Titanic. Using a one handed Titanic with the your other hand on the follow’s right shoulder is sometimes more productive to get her to pause on the ‘settling’ step.
If you are lucky, and get a willing follow, ask if you can repeat the move a couple of times after your dance to smooth out the move and ask her what lead is the best.
Good luck, and keep at it!
Marie-B
Hey guys,
I have a suggestion for you men when it comes to the Titanic. The main thing like in any move is to mae your guide clear. I’ve seen advanced dancers dance with some of my friends who’ve only dance once or twice salsa in their loves and they looked like they new what they were doing because the guide was extremely clear.
When it comes to titanic, if you are doing it with both hands, you want to make sure after your pause to start doing the circular motion for the girl to turn… if you wait to long it will be to late for us ladies to start turning and we will do a regular cbl…. so you must start on your 5.
if you are doing it with one hand which is a bit more complicated… but once again you must always think of doing your guide as clear as possible for us to understand. The trick with the titanic with one hand also known as a block. is to make us feel it with a hand on your free shoulder!Anyways I hope I was helpful!
Shake care!Salil
well my problem is that even before the pause the girl thinks that it is a normal crossbody lead and keeps going in the opposite direction. what lead can i give the girl to stop her midway in the titanic position? I find it easier to give the girl a right hand turn with both hands and then do the titanic because in this case the my hands are on the girls shoulders after the cross body lead. This move is features in one of Anthony’s video probably named ‘Beginner combos in Salsa’ However with arms outstrectched it’s a different question.
Julie
Being clear is very important for leading this move. There are variations on the Titanic, so if you are having trouble, try to master the easiest one. I recommend the Titanic that Anthony teaches in our video, because there are several instances where the girl can do nothing else but follow, so it’s very clear. First, he crosses my hands so I know it isn’t a cross body and that I will be turned, then when I am in front of him with my arms outstretched, I can’t go anywhere. My advice is to watch that video very closely, and imitate Anthony in the move, because he leads it wonderfully. Also very important to maintain clarity is hitting the right beats- if the lead is late, we won’t have enough time to get around. To be clear guiding the ladies arms, placement is more important that strength (this falls under “we don’t endorse the use of force” – ladies don’t like being muscled through a combo).
Feel free to submit a video here if you’d like more specific tips from the group
Here is the Titanic episode: http://videos.addicted2salsa.com/podcast/video/salsa-dance-move-titanic-options
Salil
I remember seeing you and anthony in a video named something like ‘Beginner Salsa Combo moves’ doing the titanic with the hands crossed and admiring how smooth it looked. I started doing that one too. I have seen this video too but have to go through this in more detail
Julie
@Salil:
Was it this video?
http://videos.addicted2salsa.com/podcast/video/salsa-dance-mixer-for-beginnersSalil
yep exactly this one. I started doing this move because this way i automatically have my hands on the girls shoulder.
SalseroWannaBe
Hey, tell me if I’m wrong, but it needs to thing – leader doing clear (but not arm-breaking) signal to left turn while holding arms crossed with follower (leader’s left on top). The signal is to “tap” your hand(s) down. Then it needs a follower able to read one of this salsa basics – when you get “tap” in XBL left turn whatever is the position, don’t think, just turn: rest is into leader. After she is able to read it properly (I think that followers are obligated not to forget it, and this is common sin), you just stop herwith your hands and arms, with little of force. If you will be to soft, she will start doing weird things. Hey Julie – am I right about requiring “tap” signal awareness and knowledge from followers, unless I don’t want to force-turn them left?
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how would one learn bachata and merengue? Are there any good resources on the web or any dvds that i should buy that would help me? The problem is the clubs i go to in charlotte area many time play bachata or merengue 75% of the time. In order to not get bored I need to dance those two dances. Also are there dvds for beginner – intermediate salsa. I can do the basic steps and cross body leads without any problems. I need to add some more steps to my salsa repetoire. I like anthony’s videos and many girls think my level has gone up significantly when i do them on the dance floor. I wish there was a dvd of videos like these. I haven’t bought any dvds for dancing so I am not sure what to get. I think one for shines might be good. any suggestions?
SalseroWannaBe
Bachata needs a class, for merengue you can use youtube
.donv69
Agreed. You can take some of your salsa and bachata moves to Merengue. Merengue is easy to learn from Youtube.
Bachata is okay to learn once you know the basic steps. But yeah, a class is definitely required for it.
latino
i’ve learned merengue through youtube and friends. don’t be shy to simply ask some guys and girls to come over and have a lil dance session , it’s something that takes time and love for it, as for bachata u could learn the basics through youtube i suppose but watch those vids that are of random ppl dancing it and recording it, the online lessons are too proper and more for professional dancers, , i recommend a class and friends to show u some moves, don’t be embarrassed to learn dances from other cultures, that’s great actually
~buena suerte
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Hello Friends,
One of my beginner friends asked me a question that I had no answer to and I was dumb struck as to why i hadn’t had the same question all this time. Salsa is said to be a quick-quick-slow dance. But how is it quick-quick-slow when we step or change weight on every beat. For eg. we step(beat 1)-change weight(beat 2)-replace step(beat 3)-hold(beat 4). so where does the quick-quick-slow come in. it should be quick-quick-quick-hold. I practise to some pure clave tunes in which the only instrument playing is the clave. on the 2 side the clave strikes on the 2nd and 3rd beats. I find it very difficult to complete the 3rd step on the 2nd slap of the clave even if I am on time for the 1st slap of the clave. Because the 3rd step is supposed to be slow and the 2nd slap of the clave happens very fast after the 1st. Is my dancing fundamentals or knowledge of clave wrong in some way?hasen_a
I am just a beginner, but the topic interests me as well. I wouldn’t exactly go as far as trying to synchronize every step/move with each instrument accordingly. I feel that the whole salsa rhythm given by the music ensemble should accomplish this.
The clave can be taken as an instrument which keeps the time like a clock. Did you ever take lessons where you try to distinctively hear out each salsa instrument?
I had a student teacher which made us clap the main beat instruments and that really helped me hear the beat. First I thought this to be stupid but now I sort of thanked him for it.
gnss
Sorry @ salilsurendran – I’m too much of a beginner to answer your question about the clave but my dancing experience (many years of ballroom) gave me my opinion about this “quick-quick-slow” rhythm. In ballroom you have this or similar rhythms quite often an I learned that ballroom teachers use it too to “explain” salsa – it seems to make it more clear for these students – but also is wrong in my opinion.
As you said it should look like “quick-quick-quick-hold” that is what I’m dancing and I think every salsa dancer on this planet (hope I’m not wrong with this one). The thing about “quick-quick-slow” is, that it indicates 1: Step (change your weight), 2: Step (change your weight), 3 Step (settle your weight between your feet that you stand on both of them in the same way), 4 (bring your weight to the foot of step 3).
I haven’t thought earlier about how difficult it would be to write this down instead of showing it, but I hope this got clear.In an small excourse I want to try showing this by telling you about (ballroom) Rumba – as a matter of fact this given counting rhythm is right there (quick-quick-slow). The whole dance, for everyone never heard about rumba, is in its steps very similar to salsa – as much as cha-cha is. The way I explained how steps would work in this rhythm is quite what you do while dancing rumba, its just a little more emphazized (when doing your 3rd step, the foot on position 2 is staying streched till you break out to the front or back with it again).
So I wanted to do this all clear to you but now I’m a little ashamed because I don’t know if anyone could follow my words.
If not I’m very sorry – but I want to give you this youtube link to show rumba not just in words (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyvPYntKUrQ) hope this explains the rest – I think since you seem very interested in musicality you should get it by watching.donv69
The quick-quick-slow doesn’t have as much to do with the steps as it does with the movement of the body. Remember that the lead’s role is to present the follower the ability to express herself with styling.
So during that slow step (so to speak) the follower takes that extra beat to express herself.
So while your feet do step-step-step-pause, the rest of your body does quick-quick-slow.
Don’t worry about it so much now, it will come after some practice and you’ll understand.
gnss
So I know about giving the follower the time to express herself – in this case this called rhythm has something right – the weird thing is noone tells you “quick-quick-slow when you are more advanced… this is more for beginners in my opinion – and no beginner that I know gives any room for expression.
lonbluster
Yes, indeed, quick quick slow is something for beginners, to ease your mind.
Actually I see it as quick-hold=slow. Actually when you dance freely you don’t really see the hold, except in some moments, like, before a cross body lead.In an article, I had read that Salsa on2 is more slow-quick-slow, while on1 is instead quick-quick-slow
I have 2 NY style(on2) teachers: one teaches to count 123-567, the other teaches 234-678…but the dance style is the same: Salsa On2!! When you dance properly you can’t count, you have to hear the music, and relax, and enjoy!!About the clave, I have to say that in most of the songs it is not actually played, but it is just the basis of the song arrangement, so that if you are deeply immersed in the song you will eventually use it to keep your timing on track!!
This is more clear on the On2 style where you have the 2 consecutive steps 2-3 or 6-7(break forward or backward-step in place) matching the 2 of the 2-3 or 3-2 clave.
Sometimes the Clave is for me the only real reference and dancing solo I can actually step on the exactly clave beats, adding a recovery step to match 6 against 5 beats!!See this article: it will tell you to do whatever you want!!No rules:
http://www.salsaville.com/dancing_behind_the_beat.htmdonv69
It’s one of those cases of too much information for the beginner to process. I had the same problem when I started. The only way to make the connection is by practicing a lot.
Don’t worry about it so much. This is one of those things where just knowing it in your head isn’t enough. The other part of the learning process is done subconsciously when you actually dance to the music in clubs, etc.
DanAshley
Salisuredran wrote:
“Salsa is said to be a quick-quick-slow dance.”
Said to be quick-quick-slow? Have you heard a professional instructor say this? I’ve seen it on internet blogs, but that is not what is taught at the studio where I take lessons in Chicago.
I admit I have heard it from one instructor. There was a nightclub called “The Buzz” in Chicago with a very popular instructor who gave a free lesson once a week. She was from New Jersey, and never said “quick quick slow”, but she left in summer 2008 and went to another nightclub, so they got a replacement. Now, the replacement did teach using the quick-quick-slow metaphor. But his crowds were thin, and The Buzz shut down. I think he lasted about 5 months before the place closed its doors in December 2008.
Personally, although I admit I have heard the salsa rhythm being described as quick-quick-slow, I’ve heard it only rarely.
Most of my dancing is on 1, and so far I’ve heard it described two ways:
and ONE, TWO, THREE
and FIVE, SIX, SEVENor
One, two, three, pause
five, six, seven, pause.So . . . I agree with you, salilsuredran, quick quick slow is not a particularly helpful way to describe the dance rhythm.
lonbluster
Yeah…I agree…don’t bother with quick-quick-slow!!
Dance and Smile instead!
Happy new Year!!gnss
Hehe – in a way that is what I think about it too – JUST HAVE FUN WITH THE DANCE, THE MUSIC AND EVERYTHING ELSE AND DON’T CARE.
But I got in this discussion because as Ionbluster said it “this is for beginners to find a place to start” – in my opinion, giving someone the opertunity to get started is really a good idea.
But the problem is where I hear this all the time, no one dances salsa – and after this explanation they hate this dance. On the other hand some of this crowd who had the chance to learn a little from myself actually fell in love with salsa in a way.And for me it is very important that someone who has not the slightest clue what salsa is, falls in love with it like I did – its the best thing happend to me in my life so I want to share this.
Salil
I am sorry to say this but I am facing this problem on almost any salsa forum that i post a question to. There is a long list of answers and most of them don’t answer to the point. I am not trying to insult people who are trying to help me. I am very grateful to all of you but I notice this trend where I read a long list of answers and find the answer to my question either unanswered or no clear answer. I am still not clear about the quick-quick-slow question. I think most of you are saying it should be quick-quick-quick-hold. Though a lot of instructors do teach you to do the quick-quick-slow where the slow step is replacing your left foot and then changing weight on 3rd and 4th beat. The question that has remained unanswered is the 2nd and 3rd beat of the 2-side of the clave. I find the 2nd slap of the clave to be too fast as compared to the other slaps. Is it really on the 3rd beat or is it on 2.5 or 2.75…. The reason being I find it hard to do the 2nd step and then be on time for the 3 because the clave slaps so quickly. but i have no trouble on the 3-side of the clave which is 5 – 6.5 – 8
donv69
@Salil: I think you are thinking way too much. Like I have previously said before, this is one of those questions where there is no technical answer, you just need to dance it and feel it.
lonbluster
I don’t see why you mind so much about the Clave! It is just a reference, but you don’t necessarily have to step on it!
You sayd that at least 1 step matches the clave, which is your 2, in-place step for the On1 Salsa style.
That’s enough mate! Having noticed your feet(2 or 6) step all the time(every 2 measures) on that hit that’s what make you sure you are on time!! Nothing more is needed. The rest of the clave is all upper-body movements!See: above 2-3 clave, below 3-2 clave
..x| x x x x x|…
..8|1 2 3 4| 5 6 7 8|1..
…|x x x x x |x..You have other references also to take care about. To be perfect on time you should be checking both the Clave and the 1234-5678 steps, as cross reference.
Dancing on2 there is another reference, which is most important for me, and that is the “chachacha”, happening between each measure.
Anyway, all of these have to be matched unconsciously, as I told you, you can’t keep checking them all the time while you dance on a nightclub, you will get crazy!!
Cheers
lonbluster
I don’t see why you mind so much about the Clave! It is just a reference, but you don’t necessarily have to step on it!
You sayd that at least 1 step matches the clave, which is your 2, in-place step for the On1 Salsa style.
That’s enough mate! Having noticed your feet(2 or 6) step all the time(every 2 measures) on that hit that’s what make you sure you are on time!! Nothing more is needed. The rest of the clave is all upper-body movements!See: above 2-3 clave, below 3-2 clave
..x|__x_x____x__x__x|…
..8|1 2 3 4| 5 6 7 8|1..
…|x__x__x____x_x__|x..You have other references also to take care about. To be perfect on time you should be checking both the Clave and the 1234-5678 steps, as cross reference.
Dancing on2 there is another reference, which is most important for me, and that is the “chachacha”, happening between each measure.
Anyway, all of these have to be matched unconsciously, as I told you, you can’t keep checking them all the time while you dance on a nightclub, you will get crazy!!
Cheers
lonbluster
sorry…I was trying to do a proper scheme, but the formatting won’t allow it…
donv69
When I first got my rhythm, I was stepping on the cowbells. 1-3 5-7. So easy for songs that had cowbells.
Now I picked up on something else when dancing and have no clue what it is. But I am always on time. But when the cowbells kick in, I notice that I step a big before the cowbell; which is fine.
I have no clue what I’m stepping on and I don’t worry about it. I am just happy that I can do crazy moves now and impress the girls.
Next…Styling. Make the girls melt.
hooknc
Quick Quick Slow is used to slow the transition down from the 3 to the 5.
In a lot of cases when I’ve been teaching people will skip/miss the rest on the 4.
Saying quick quick sloooow will get the people thinking “Hey, I need to wait just a second here…”
You could also say “one, two, three, rest, five” or “one, two, three, four, etc…”
But all the above is a mouth full when you’re trying to count out the beat for beginners when the music is playing.
I prefer teaching with “one, two, three, , four, five, six” or “forward, two, three, back, six, seven”.
Quick, quick, slow is just a different wording for counting out the beat, emphasizing the fact that we take a rest on the 4 and 8.
TD
The slow is because it consumes 2 beats 3rd and 4th. Whereas the quick-quick are 1 and 2.
That is why we count 1-2-3 , 5-6-7. the 4 and 8 are merged into 3 and 7 respectively.Otherwise your can count 1-2-3-4, 1-2-3-4. Or 1-2-3-tap, 1-2-3-tap. Try and you will appreciate the slow then – gives you a break
gnss
I think what the “slow” means and what it stands for in counts was clear to anyone of us.
We can conclude that this kind of “counting” is made for beginners to have a clearer feeling about the break – and ofcourse helping someone to learn how it works is good at all time.
dahvee
@Salil:
Maybe this will help.
http://scphillips.com/dance/salsarhythm.html
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Hello Friends,
One of the problems I have is that I would like to dance everyday but good salsa socials doesn’t occur everyday. So I practise solo. Do members of this forum practise that way? And what is good for solo practise, do you just do the basics again and again or also complex turns? One of my friends told me that he never practised solo because it will mess up your moves since you are not thinking about leading. Which sites do you go to on the internet to find out the moves to practise? And do you guys practise the basics again and again. My teacher told me to keep practising basic steps as much as possible.newinnc
have you looked for a partner who would practice with you offdays?
Anthony Persaud
I definitely practice on my own (solo). Depending on what level you are on in salsa dancing determines the exercises. For beginners, I recommend working on the basics steps over and over again. I was reading Outliers the other day and it stated that for one to Master a skill/task – people have to repeat it over 10,000 times. Not to discourage you, but to let you know that you can always improve the basic step. Try dancing the basic step while doing something else with your upper body. I used to practice the basic step with my favorite songs, while folding laundry and moving around the dorm (I was in college).
For intermediate, I recommend get a full length mirror and work on footwork and body isolations. There is usually a rule that states that if you can’t do footwork correctly in front of yourself (mirror), then you’ll have a harder time doing it in front of your partner.
For advanced dancers, you can always use the “ghost” partner to help you work on your mental speed. This exercise is similar to above where you imagine you are dancing with a ‘ghost’ partner, but only plan the next move 4 counts before the current move you are doing ends. Doing this will help speed your thinking when dancing and also improves correcting from errors in real partnerwork dance.
Salil
@newinnc: Yes I am trying to find a partner.
Salil
@Anthony Persaud: thanks a lot. that was really good advice.
Marco
@Anthony P. (Does anyone ever call you Tony?)
Off of your comment above about Intermediates practicing footwork and body isolations. Does this just mean shine work, or is there something else I’m missing. A YTube link would work fine if you know of one.
donv69
man, every time I want to reply Anthony’s already beaten me to it and I always agree with his comments.
One of the things that I tried to practise a lot on my own is being able to follow music. Once you can follow music, nothing can stop you.
About 2 months ago a girl caught me lipping my steps; so I stopped doing that real fast. But I have noticed that I don’t count my steps that anymore except some of the more complex moves.
Cold Salsero 1:47 am on April 17, 2011Permalink |
Dude, you posted this question everywhere!
I gave you some answers on another forum 